How Much House Can You Actually Afford (By Income!)

Transcript:

On this episode of the Personal Finance Podcast, we're gonna talk about how much house you can afford buy income.

What's up everybody, and welcome to the Personal Finance Podcast. I'm your host Andrew, founder of Master money.co. And today on the Personal Finance Podcast, we are gonna be talking about how much. You can afford buy income. If you guys have any questions, make sure you hit us up on Instagram or Twitter at Master Money Co.

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And make sure you are checking us out. On Master Money on YouTube. We are creating now two videos every single week and we are creating fresh content for you guys. And some of the recent videos coming out are gonna be 13 Roth IRA mistakes that you need to avoid. We're gonna talk about how to get to your first a hundred K and do some deep dives on that.

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So the more of you that subscribe on YouTube, the more content we are gonna be producing. So really excited for that as well. Make sure you check that out today. Now in this episode, we are gonna go through, The home buying process and how much home you can afford. I'm gonna give you the step-by-step guide on how to figure out the calculations to get to the point where you understand how much home you can afford.

But in addition, I'm gonna talk through how do lenders figure out how much you're approved for and some of the things that you need to avoid when lenders approve you. I'm gonna give you how much house you can afford by income, and we're gonna go through seven or eight different incomes to show you some examples of how much house you can afford by income.

Then we're gonna talk about what level. Stairway to Wealth. Does buying a house fit into, cuz this is a big question that we get a lot, so I wanna make sure that we clarify where that falls in with the Stairway to Wealth. And if you're not familiar with the Stairway to Wealth, it is our order of operations when it comes to building your wealth and building generational wealth.

So any wealth builder out there, it's the order of operations to learn how to do that. And we're gonna talk about things to consider when buying a house. On this episode, including the biggest housing myths that you wanna avoid, and I want you to ingrain some of those into your brain. So if that's something you're interested in, let's get into it.

All right, so off the top, the first thing I want to talk through is how lenders figure out if you're approved, because this is a massive misconception. For folks who do not understand how this process works, and they think a lender approved them, so that's how much house they can afford. I want you to avoid data at all costs.

In fact, I want you to look at a lender and the amount that they approve you for, I want you to understand it is not even remotely close to how much house you can afford. For example, when my wife and I built our recent house, we had to go get pre-approved for a specific loan so that we could build the house.

And when we are pre-approved, we were approved for an amount that was absolutely way too much for the amount of house that we were willing to actually pay. And so you have to understand how do identify that fine line. So here's exactly how lenders figure out if you're gonna be. When you apply for a mortgage, lenders are gonna usually look at something called your debt to income ratio, and sometimes they call this the D T I and abbreviation, and this is your total monthly debt payments divided by your gross monthly income.

Now grosses before tax, it's your gross monthly income. Written as a percentage, so that's gonna be your debt to income ratio. Now, how do they figure this out? Lenders usually use something called a 28 36 rule as a healthy sign of debt to income ratio, meaning that you will not spend more than 28% of your gross monthly income on mortgage payments.

So gross meaning before tax, you will not spend more than 28% of that. On mortgage payments or more than 36% of your income on total debt payments. So total debt payments, meaning your mortgage, and this also includes student loans, car loans, credit card debt, all those different things. So for example, if you have a ton of debt, then the amount that you're gonna be approved for is actually going to go down across the board because they do not believe in you being able to afford a mortgage and all these debt payments as well, which is a good thing for both sides.

It's a good thing for. And it's a good thing for the lender as well that they've take into consideration what your other debts are. Now, if your debt to income ratio is outside of the 28 36 rule, then some lenders may approve you for a loan. And this is how we got in trouble in 2007 and 2008, where too many lenders were approving people who did not qualify within this range, but they may charge you a higher interest rate if you are outside of this qualification range.

Rule number one, this is actually higher than what I'm gonna tell you, that you're gonna afford for a house payment. So you need to understand. If you are above that, then you cannot afford a house yet. And if you think you can afford a house, then some other expenses outside of this 28 36 range needs to be.

Much lower than the average bear because you need to understand that if you buy a house for more than you can afford, you'll become completely house poor. And I want you to avoid that at all costs. Why? Because I want you to build generational wealth. And the way to build generational wealth is to reduce your expenses on some of the big items.

And don't overpay for some of the big items so that you can ensure that you are putting as many dollars as possible towards wealth building activities. And once you start to do that, you take your extra dollars and put them towards wealth building activities. That means that you can pursue financial freedom.

This is the goal. And so the entire goal is to make sure we don't overpay for a house and we don't buy more house than we can afford. That is what we are talking about here, making sure that you do not buy more. Than you can afford. Now, let's dive into the step-by-step guide on how to decide what you can afford.

All right, so step one is to figure out what 30% of your net income is. Now you notice I'm saying net income. This means the amount of money that is on your paycheck that hits your bank account every single month. So, The quick math to do this, if you don't know how to do the math, is take your take home pay whatever your take home pay is every single month.

Go into your bank statement. Add up how much money hits your account every single month, what your total income is, and multiply that by 0.30, the 30%, because what we're trying to figure out is what 30% of our net income is. Now, why do I want it to be 30% or less of your net income? The reason for this is if you just spend more than that, you are gonna be toting a very fine line on being house.

We do not want that. We just talked about why? Because if you are house poor, you are not going to be able to build wealth. Now, if you live in a bigger city and you have lower costs in other areas, maybe like transportation costs, for example, is much lower, then maybe you have to spend a little more, but you have to reduce your costs somewhere else.

This has to be a balance. There's a. Fine line here and you have to be able to balance this out. And you may be saying to yourself, well, I can't afford that in this city. Well, the problem there is you don't make enough income then. And we do have an income problem in this country. I understand that because expenses are rising and incomes truthfully are not rising.

And in fact that there are layoffs and all, all these other things happening. Shows that, but at the same time, you have to do what is right for you. Otherwise, you are gonna be digging yourself into a financial hole that you are not gonna be able to get out of very quickly over time. And the longer you wait to build wealth, the harder it gets.

So I want you to understand this as early as you possibly can so that you can get to that point. There's gotta be a balance here. Either reduce your costs somewhere else or pay 30% or less of your income. Now if you are pursuing financial independence and you wanna become fire or you wanna retire early, then 25.

Or less, or 20% or less on housing costs because you still wanna hit those investment goals. So as long as you're hitting your investment goals and your other expenses are reduced, you're still hitting your investment goals and it goes above 30%, then fine. If you're hitting those goals, that's what truly matters.

But if you're not hitting your investment goals and it is at 30%, or if it's even slightly below 30%, then you need to reduce those housing costs to get to that point. This goes for people who rent. 30% or less on housing costs is the number one key that you need to understand because housing, food, transportation are three of the biggest expenses out there.

And if you can control those big three, what happens is you really can build generational wealth. Stop focusing on the coffee and start focusing on the things that actually matter when it comes to building wealth. Step two is I want you to utilize something like a mortgage calculator to figure out what.

Home budget is because there are some other things that you have to factor in to make sure that you can afford this home. Most people think it's just the mortgage. That's it. I gotta pay the mortgage. But there are other factors such as your insurance, for example. So you're gonna have to call up an insurance broker, ask them what it would cost in this price range on average to have a house and how much the insurance is going to cost.

You're gonna add that into your total cost. You're gonna add in taxes on specific properties. Now, how do you find taxes on properties? So you can search your town and then search property appraiser, and you're gonna figure out what the tax rate is on specific properties in your area. So say for example, you're looking at a specific neighborhood.

My neighborhood, for example, has additional fees called C D D fees because they built a brand new neighborhood and around here we have to pay additional fees on top of our taxes. So our taxes are much higher than the average person. You need to know that before you buy a house. Otherwise, it's going to really eat into the amount of house that you can buy, or you're gonna become house poor if you don't understand what the taxes are.

So you need to look at what the taxes are for each specific house that you're looking at and factor that into your equation because taxes vary from different locations depending on what's going on. In that location. So start to get a good idea of what the taxes would be for the areas that you're looking at when you buy a house, so that you have those numbers available.

And then lastly, if you are putting less than 20% down on this house, you're gonna have what is called PMI and p and i is mortgage insurance for folks who do not put 20% down, it's just extra fees and extra insurance that you have to carry. And it's basically a penalty for not putting 20% down. On a property.

We'll talk about how much you need to put down on a property, depending on your financial situation, a little bit later in this episode. But you need to factor in P M I if you're putting less than 20% down. This also goes into your housing equation. That's step two. Step three is you gotta factor in closing costs as well.

Most people don't do this. So most people go into buying a house and they maybe think about closing costs, but they don't factor them into the actual total price of the house, which is exactly what you need to be doing. So mortgage calculator could help you do this as well, but you gotta cover the most important parts of the home buying process.

Number one is appraisal fees. If you have any appraisal fees associated with the house, maybe you want an appraiser to go out to see how much that house is worth, and if you on the buying side need to pay for. Sometimes the seller pays for it and you can negotiate that, but sometimes the buyer pays for it, so you gotta look at those appraisal fees and see how much that can be.

For example, an appraisal can be anywhere from $500 to $2,000, depending on where you live and the size of the home. If you have a much larger home, it could be even more home inspections. The next one. You have to always do a home inspection. If you were gonna buy a house as your primary residence or any property for that matter, if someone's trying to get you to wave inspection, never ever do that.

I've bought and sold dozens of properties in my lifetime and every single time they're gonna find certain things that you cannot see. A home inspector is three, $400. You can do a seven day inspection period on no matter what house that you buy, but you have to have that inspection period. There never.

Waive your inspection period. Loan origination fees, an additional fee that you gotta factor in. Credit reports are more fees that your lender or the title company is going to charge. If there's attorneys involved. You have to make sure you factor in those fees. And obviously home insurance and property taxes we just talked about.

So making sure that you factor in your closing costs in your overall home budget is a very important thing to. So you need to make sure that you're looking at right around 4% of the price of the house is right around where you wanna be. So if you're buying a $200,000 home and you multiply that by 4%, you're gonna get closing costs of $8,000.

Yeah, I know it's a lot, but that is right around where it's going to land in many situations, depending on. Especially if you're getting a mortgage. If you're getting a mortgage, your closing costs are gonna be even higher. Add that to the 20% down that you have to put down and save. For a $200,000 house, you're looking at $48,000 that you need to have available in down payment plus closing costs.

This is a huge factor that you gotta make sure that you put into the cost of buying a house Now. Some other things that you gotta consider on step four is you gotta consider home ownership costs. This is very important and it's one that a lot of people don't see, some of what we call invisible costs.

When you go and buy a house, there are tons of invisible costs when you buy a house, and a lot of people realize it later on. In fact, an article just came out that 90% of homeowners did not realize how much a home would cost because of invisible costs. This is something, you gotta know this up. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna give you some of these invisible costs that you may see on average, and then you gotta figure out in my specific area, cuz this is very location dependent, what would this actually cost for the houses that I'm looking at?

So one thing to consider first is utilities. Now when it comes to utilities, if you have a older house, your utility build is going to be higher because it's much harder to heat and it's much harder to cool a house when it's older if it doesn't have the proper insulation and other pieces inside of that.

So when you are looking at a house, consider the age because the utilities are gonna be very, very different. For example, I had a three bedroom, two bathroom house as our starter house that was 1200 square feet, and in that 1200 square foot house, I paid more in utilities than my brand new house now, which is three times the size.

Why? Because my brand new house had proper insulation. It had the proper things in place. My older house, which was much smaller, significantly smaller, which means less room had to be cooled and heated. But it still cost me more because my AC had to run harder and it was not as efficient as my new house that had all the modern technologies and all these different things.

So you gotta factor in that timeline when it comes to utilities. So do you have electric? You gotta factor in. You gotta factor in gas, trash. Those four things are gonna be things that you really need to think through. How much is this going to cost me? Because if you're off on this, you could be off three, $400, that's 36 to $4,800 per year that you are off, that you're gonna be having to pay out of pocket, and it can really change the amount of money that you can afford for a house.

Next, you wanna consider maintenance and repairs. This is the big one that most people do not realize how much it's going to cost. Again, age of house matters. So if you have an older house, there's gonna be more maintenance and repairs on that house than if you have a younger house. Now, one thing to consider first is CapEx or capital expenditures.

What does that mean? That is a thing that we use when we invest in rent a property. So look at things like the roof. When does that need to be? Most roofs last for 20 to 40 years, depending on what type of roof it is. So how much life is left in that roof? Your inspector's gonna be able to tell you that your AC unit, how much life is left in that AC unit?

Look at the plumbing. Do you have Barry Old Plumbing? I used to own a property, a duplex that was built in 1957. It had metal pipes in all the metal pipes. Heero it. I had to pay $3,000 to line those pipe. And that was cost. I did not anticipate having, so you need to have an inspector looking at plumbing as well to make sure you know what type of pipes are down there, especially if it's an old house.

If it's an old house. You gotta check that out. Make sure you understand those costs. In addition, how much is it gonna cost you for landscaping services? Are you gonna mow the lawn on your own or are you gonna have somebody else come out? What does that cost to have those landscaping services? What does it cost for maintenance costs?

Like having your AC unit tuned up every single year, H V A C tuned up every single. You gotta think through all of these things. So one thing I would do if you are brand new to buying a house is I would Google, Hey, what are the things that I need to be aware of on the maintenance side of a house? And we'll link up one down below so that you can check it out as well, like a checklist so you can figure out what those costs are gonna be.

Because this goes into your housing cost. This is part of your 30%. Next part, upgrades in additions. How much do you need to pay for upgrades in additions? My wife and I built a new house, but we still put a bunch of upgrades and additions inside that house after it was built. Why? Because the builder was more expensive than it would be for us to do it on our own.

So you gotta factor in those costs. If you wanna remodel the kitchen like you're buying a fixer wrapper, for example, you gotta figure out how much is that going to cost. And does that fit into your budget plan? And then step five is if all of this is too much, how do you reduce that housing cost? Well, one way to reduce that housing cost is that you can save for a bigger down payment.

Now I understand at the time I'm recording this, housing prices are going crazy. So saving for a bigger down payment sounds like a scary thing to do. Why? Because you may be considering, well, Our housing price is gonna go even higher in the future. Well, none of us know if they're gonna go higher or lower.

I hear people all the time saying they think it's gonna go higher for the next 10 years. They think it's gonna go lower for the next 10 years. Nobody knows exactly what's gonna happen, but what you need to do is do what's best for you to make sure that you don't overpay for a house. Because a house, we've talked about this before in our buy verse rent episode, which will link up down.

But in by Ren, I explained to you how a house is not that great of an asset. In fact, houses on average across the country have appreciated 4% on average over the last 70 years because of these invisible costs. These invisible costs eat into the return of a house. Your primary residence is a subpar asset at best, so making sure that you know that.

And if it is not affordable, then you gotta save more for a down payment on a house. Now, first time home buyers, I am okay with you putting down five to 10% or even getting an F h a loan because it's your first house. But if this is your second house, then you need to be putting at least 20% down. Why?

Because you can roll over the equity in the old house. Into your new house if you need to. So putting 20% down is imperative on your second house if it's your first house, I understand sometimes it's hard to scoop up that down payment, making this easier, especially in a housing market where is absolutely crazy.

If you can afford the monthly payments on what's gonna happen, including maintenance, mortgage taxes, utilities, all these other things, if those fit into your 30% range, but you can put only 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10% down, then I am completely fine with that. If it's your first house, second. You are rolling equity in.

You need to make sure that you are at least putting 20% down because you already have a property that you own. And those are the steps that you need to think through before you buy a house. Now let's get into how much home you can actually afford. Okay, so we just talked about the calculation on how to get to this point to figure out how much house you can afford, but I'm gonna give you some examples.

Buy income of how much house you can afford as we go through this process. So the formula. 30% of your net income, how much house can you afford? So let's say for example, that you make $4,000 every single month. If you make $4,000 every single month, the range that you can be in is $1,200. So either you're gonna have to be in a lower cost of living area, and maybe you're in a state where housing prices are not crazy yet.

Like Ohio has some areas like this. Alabama has some areas like this. So if you're in a lower cost of living area, Then maybe you can fit into that range. If you make $5,000 a month, and this is combined obviously with you and your spouse or whoever lives in your home, if you make $5,000 a month, $1,500 is what you can spend on housing.

$7,000 a month. $2,100 is what you can spend on housing. $10,000 a month is $3,000 on housing, $15,000 a month is $4,500. $20,000 is $6,000 and $25,000 a. Is $7,500 is what you're gonna afford. Now, some of these numbers may sound like, especially if you're on the lower end of the spectrum, these may sound like, well, how am I ever gonna be able to afford a house?

There's a couple of things that you can do when it comes to this. The only things you can do is reduce expenses, which. When you don't make a lot of money, reducing expenses a lot of times is not an option because you only have so much that you can cut back. But if you earn more, you have infinite earning potential.

So that is my second suggestion, is looking at your earning side. This is why we always talk about earning more income on this podcast is because you're earning potential as infinite, but in addition, it solves a lot of problems, especially when you don't make a lot. So a couple of ways to earn more income is to negotiate your salary at your job.

Look for another job, because the average person who job hops makes 15 to 25% more when they find their next job. That's number two. Number three is to find a side hustle that can create an income for you on the Master Money YouTube channel. We just came out with a video called The Four Side Hustles that can turn into a million dollar business.

In that video, I talk about the. Different businesses that I absolutely love, that you can start as a side hustle and they can turn into a full-time business. So make sure you check out that video, because those are the four that I think are awesome right now. Now, what level of the Stairway to wealth should you be on in order to afford a house?

So some of the steps before buying a house are these. You have to have all high interest debt paid off, meaning that high interest debt needs to be gone. Anything above 6% interest needs to be paid off before you can get to the point where you're buying a house unless it's your mortgage payment.

Because if mortgage interest rates are high, but you can still afford a house within that 6% range, then that's a different store. But anything outside of that mortgage above a 6% interest rate needs to be paid off in order to be able to afford a house. If you have credit card debt, you should not be buying.

If you have a car loan with a 15% interest rate, you should not be buying a house yet. You need to pay off that car. Loan. Number two is you need to have an emergency fund fully funded in order to buy a house. Why? Because there is a lot of emergencies that happens when you own a house and that is on you.

It's not on your landlord anymore. That is on you completely. So you need to have at least six months. Of at least one person's income in your household saved up in an emergency fund. Because if there's two incomes in your household, one person loses their job, then you at least have the other income to supplement.

And you have six months of one person's income available to you, and that needs to build up to two months eventually, once you build that house. But you gotta have that six month emergency fund fully funded to make sure that you have the protection available to you when you buy a house. Now in my budget line items, we have one called home maintenance and we have one called home.

Home maintenance is for the regular maintenance every single month that we have from lawn care to pool care to landscaping that we do. I just put a whole bunch of flowers and stuff in last weekend, and so that came outta home Maintenance. Home repair is things that happen that you do not expect. Things like your AC breaks down or you need an electrician to come out to fix some lighting.

Those are things that comes out of home repair. So between those two line items, hopefully that helps you with your budget. That's how I separate it in my budget to make sure that I have those available. And then number three is you need to be hitting your investment goals before you buy a house because you need to have that funding available.

You're hitting those investment goals. If you're not hitting your investment goals, you will never be able to retire. And if you buy a house, it's gonna make it even worse. You want to make sure that you can pursue financial freedom and you can afford that before you are buying. If you're not able to hit your investment goals that are gonna hit you to your retirement number by whatever age you wanna retire, then you're going to have to back it up a little bit, figure out and reassess exactly where you need to be hitting those investment goals.

So for a lot of people, this could be the Roth IRA level on the Stairway wealth. If you're maxing out that Roth over the course of 30 years, you're gonna have over a million dollars in that account. Is that enough for you to retire? That is the question that you have to ask yourself before you hit. So if you're at the Roth HSA level and you're maxing those out, then that would be the level that I would start to consider buying a house.

Now, let's look at some things to consider before you buy a house. All right, so here are some things I want you to consider before buying a house and before you buy a house. These considerations are very important to evaluate for your own personal situation, especially when you're talking with a spouse or a partner or anybody else.

You gotta make sure that you are talking through some of this stuff before you buy that. So as you start to make this decision, make sure you're asking yourself these questions. There are three myths that I want to go through. So the first one is, if you were paying rent, you were throwing the money away.

So you see that we just talked through how to run the numbers on buying a house, and for a lot of situations, renting may be the better option than buying a house because there are so many costs associated with buying a house that most people do not understand. It's not just your mortgage. It is everything else involved in buying a house.

Whereas if you're renting a house, your landlord's gonna take care of a lot of those additional expenses because it's baked into your rent cost, and so they will take care of that. So 30% or less on your rent is also the number that you need to be hitting when it comes to making sure that you can still build wealth.

So paying rent is not throwing the money away. There's a couple of reasons to pay rent. One, you run the numbers and see renting is a better situation. Number two, if you get more of value out of renting than you do buying, maybe you don't wanna deal with all this maintenance stuff. Maybe you don't want to have to worry about paying for if the roof caves in, you could just call up your landlord and they can handle that.

So the two considerations are what value are you getting out of renting if you're getting a ton of value out of not having to worry. Stuff. That's amazing. And the second consideration, if you run the numbers and you see that renting as a better option, then I would go with renting. Myth number two is that housing prices always go up.

It may seem like that right now the time I'm recording this, housing prices have been going up for over a decade, and so it may seem like that right now, but this is not the case. In fact, it is very normal for housing prices to go down during certain timeframes as well, like a recessionary periods. You can look at 2007, 2008.

Before they went down. I don't anticipate that happening anytime soon, but what do I know? I don't have a crystal ball. So if you want to make sure that you are going to have a house that is sustainable for you, you gotta anticipate living in that house for 10 years. So when you buy that house, you need to make sure that you are willing to live there for 10 years, because if the market comes down, you need to stay in that house in order to not go underwater.

Houses go underwater all the time when prices are reduced and you wanna make sure that's not you number. Buying a house is always a good investment because of all these invisible costs that are associated with buying a house. It is not always a good investment. In fact, in a lot of situations, it's not a great investment.

When it's your primary residence. When it's a rental property or it's for investments, guess what? Your tenant wakes up every single day. Your tenant goes to work, they come home to pay down your mortgage. That's a good investment because you're not plowing away money every single month into that house and said, your tenant is paying for that, especially if you run the numbers.

What is not a good investment is your primary residence. Your primary residence increases and value at a very small percentage every year. Now, this is coming from someone who's owned a house for over 10 years, and I'm telling you this and people always argue with me about this, but if you run the numbers and you do the math, your primary residence, Is not a good investment.

Do the math. Buy verse, rent episode. We talk about this. Make sure you're running the numbers, you do the math. You can see the increase over time. Now, sure, I have made six figures on buying and selling my own primary residence. I understand that, but I also did it during a upswing in the market. So there are times where buying a house is not always a good investment.

It does not always go up. There are invisible costs that are involved. So making sure you run those numbers and just have an educated decision before you go and buy a. Now, the second thing I want you to consider is making sure that you're buying a house because it fits into what your dream life is. If you've always wanted to own a house and you just want to own a house and that's part of your dream life, that is a, okay, listen, don't let anybody else tell you it's not okay to buy a house if you wanna buy a house, just because it's not a good investment.

There's a ton of other reasons to buy a house, which are some of the reasons why I bought one. Maybe you want your kids to grow up in a nice area that has go to school districts. Their friends are in that area. You have the scenery of the woods in your background, or maybe a lake or an. And it's calming.

It makes you happy. It brings you joy. Guess what? That's a great reason to buy a house. Maybe your aging parents are moving in and you need more space, or you need more space because you have, you're a growing family. That's a great reason to buy a house. Maybe you love to design a house with you and your spouse.

You wanna build a house. You've always wanted to build a custom house, and you love designing spaces. That's a great reason to buy a house because you can make it your own. You can do what you want with. Maybe you love home repair and you love tinkering around in the garage and doing little things to your house, that's a great reason to buy a house.

If that's your passion, if that's what you love to do and people love to do stuff like that, then that would be a great reason to buy a house. You still gotta buy it, right? But that would be a great reason to buy a house. Or if you just want to, you don't have a good reason, you just wanna own a house, more power to you.

That is a great reason to buy a house as well, even though you don't have a reason. So, thinking through this, making sure you're willing to stay for seven to 10 years, making sure it's 30% or less of your net income. These are the two rules that. If you're willing to do some of these things, you run the numbers, you do the math, and you figure out it's still a good decision based on what your desires and goals are for your dream life.

There is nothing wrong with buying a house. Listen, I don't wanna discourage you from buying a house. I want you to make sure that you are running the numbers so that you can buy a house properly, so that you can build generational wealth and become financially free. For you and your family. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode.

I hope you learned a ton about how to run the numbers on buying a house. If you guys have any questions, make sure you hit us up on Instagram or Twitter at Master Money Co and follow us on Spotify, apple Podcast or whatever podcast player you're listening to this podcast on right now. And I cannot thank you guys enough for listening.

Share this episode with a family or friend if you got value out of it, and we will see ya on the next episode.